Fishing The Fly Scotland Forum

Marc Fauvet

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #15 on: 18/07/2016 at 13:44 »
Many folk struggle to load some modern rods.

typically the same breed that believes that buying a Stradivarius will make them an expert violinist or that a Porsche will magically make them more attractive...   :z4 :roll :z4

Rob Brownfield

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #16 on: 19/07/2016 at 08:15 »
typically the same breed that believes that buying a Stradivarius will make them an expert violinist or that a Porsche will magically make them more attractive...   :z4 :roll :z4

However I do have a feeling that manufacturers are in a bit of a war with each other to produce the lightest, fastest, greatest rod of all time without caring about the anglers needs. Notice I said rod and not fishing rod :)

Sometimes I think the manufacturers forget that some people actually fish with the rods ;)


I will have to cut this reply short as I have a test drive booked for a Porsche...thanks for the tip ;)

Marc Fauvet

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #17 on: 19/07/2016 at 09:48 »
Rob, for sure i get your point and generally agree  :z16

but !  :z4 whilst rod companies are indeed at war with each other (it's just normal business competition)
- they work on making lighter rods: normal, who would want a heavier rod ?
- fastest: firstly, there's a great misunderstanding as to what constitutes a fast rod action.
most associate it with it being stiff or resistant to flexion. that may very well be the case and is apparent in rather poor rod design but a well designed fast blank's 'magical' properties are that these blanks react quicker to the angler/caster's input on both flexion and deflexion: they give much greater control throughout all casting phases.

about rod manufacturers not caring about anglers needs:
generally speaking, i don't agree with that at all. for sure, Sage etc all have at least one super-fast model in their lineups but the general trend globally is to have more and more rods of moderate action. they do listen to all whining...  :z4 or otherwise they'd lose a lot of business.

now, the crux of the matter is high performance tools are made for users who know how to use them and can exploit the inherent characteristics of that tool.
going back to the Porsche example, they don't make cars for beginners and they fully expect buyers to know how to drive properly.  i can't imagine why it would be any different for high-end fly fishing rods ?

our little FF world is largely plagued with lazy fad followers that are all too eager to suck up the next hype being thrown out by advertisements or some other lazy bobo in a magazine, blog, or anywhere else on the net. they're like scraggly bearded bimbos that rush out to purchase the latest lip gloss  :z4 and later start whining all over the place that the grossly overpriced lip gloss didn't change their lives.

in regards to the two most common equipment rants: fly lines and rod actions, here's a quote from Bruce Richards that says it all:
” The line rating system is 95% OK.
There is no industry rod rating system and likely never will be.
The better your casting skills, the less you will care about the previous two points. ”


dude, i'm quite sure you know all this but lets just say that this comment was meant for the general public  :wink
cheers,
marc

Rob Brownfield

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #18 on: 19/07/2016 at 15:54 »
Rob, for sure i get your point and generally agree  :z16

Firstly, the Porsche did not work, now have a test drive booked for a Morris Minor! ;)

Secondly, I am rather over simplifying things for speed of reply. You are right, many top end rods come in all sorts of actions, and I totally agree with the confusion over "fast" and "stiff". I do know that Viagra does not offer me a "fast" action ;)

I guess where I am trying to go with this is that when you read the magazines, many of the reviews go on about stiffness and its importance to casting. The rods reviewed are all the same, very rarely do you get a review of a more forgiving rod. It seems as if "traditional" is bad and "nanotechnology" is a must. Personally I believe that to be misguiding when it comes to a "fishing" rod. Even the issue of "lightness" is not as it seems. You can make a "heavy" rod feel light in the hand by using weighted reel seats/butts. I have a rod made by Diamondback, its a 6 weight, 9 foot 6. It feels incredibly light in the hand. Lighter than my 5 weight Helios.

Ah the joys....

Dave Medlyn

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #19 on: 29/07/2016 at 07:08 »
Hi.
I took the sharps rod out last night with the 40g scandi line as suggested. Overall it went pretty well. The combo performed dam good actually, but at the back of my mind was the thought that the line was a bit heavy and could be bad for the rod.  A question at this point; how do I tell if the line is too heavy? It seemed to cast well and actually shoot line, which has never happend before !! I usually use this line with my old 1936 hardy 13' and the sharps rod does feel a bit lighter. There is a 30g snowbee scandi line on eBay ATM, and I'm wondering if the 10g difference would make a change in performance?? Any thoughts??

Mike Barrio

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #20 on: 29/07/2016 at 08:57 »
Hi Dave,

10g is obviously quite a big difference in weight, but I would stab a guess that this is more likely to be sweet on the rod. Take a chance and try it, if it doesn't work out you can always put it back on Ebay ...... and one can never have too many lines to play with :)

Cheers
Mike

Dave Medlyn

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #21 on: 29/07/2016 at 09:09 »
Thanks Mike, I might just try it!!

Marc Fauvet

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #22 on: 29/07/2016 at 09:10 »
-but at the back of my mind was the thought that the line was a bit heavy and could be bad for the rod. 
-A question at this point; how do I tell if the line is too heavy?
1) forget the false notion/myth that casting a heavier line can damage a rod, it just doesn't happen.
i and several other colleagues have tried grossly overlining rods using say, 10wt lines on 2 or 3wt rods to study various casting aspects. a lot of this was all-out distance casting and no rods where damaged in any way. it feels weird but that's a different story...
2) a line is too heavy when it feels too heavy for the intended purpose.
this has more to do with the person's casting level: the less experienced casters tend to prefer a heavier line whereas the more experienced generally go for a lighter line.

hope this helps,
marc

Dave Medlyn

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #23 on: 29/07/2016 at 11:13 »
The line that most people used on this rod was a  Number 4 Kingfisher double taper silk line.  This would be equate to roughly a n 8/9 line in today's money.  One thing to be aware of is using a line that is too heavy, since this causes splitting between the upper and lower part of the ferrules.    Sharpes introduced so called " reinforced " ferrules on their rods , but even then splitting sometimes occurred.   
I'm just a bit worried about over lining the old girl.
Thanks for your comment Marc and I'm not casting big distances so over weight line should not be a problem?
Cheers
Dave

Marc Fauvet

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #24 on: 29/07/2016 at 13:11 »
Dave, let's take the example of the line you're contemplating buying.
it weighs 10g more than the one you tested. for sure, any caster will feel that its a heavier line but its only 10g: not much and very, very little when you consider the stuff below.

- apart from structural damage (bings and dings, which is the usual culprit but angler pride usually has to blame anything except themselves... ), the only thing that might break a rod is how much force the caster applies to it but that doesn't happen in fishing situations.
- going back to the distance casting example where enormous amounts of force are used, this is when these rods break, generally at the stripping guide ferrule or under the cork grip.
i can't put figures to it but those excessive amounts of force are proportionately  much, much greater (dozens at least) than the extra 10g of the heavier line with a normal, smooth, fishing distance cast.
- fish and the force they'll exerce on a rod during a fight: expecting rod failure from throwing a 10g heavier line would be like thinking that a rod will handle say, a 10lb fish just fine but will start creaking and groaning with a 15lb fish, explode with a 20lber and implode with a 30lber but thank goodness and even if it makes for a good story at the pub, it doesn't happen in real life either...  :z4 :z4 :z4

once again, just use the line that gets the job done for your needs at your competence level.  the 40g Scandi seems to be to your liking so why not spend some time with it and figure out if it needs to be changed later ?

cheers,
marc

Dave Medlyn

Re: Sharpe rod question
« Reply #25 on: 29/07/2016 at 13:28 »
Dave, let's take the example of the line you're contemplating buying.
it weighs 10g more than the one you tested.

Thanks again for your wisdom Marc. The line that I was contemplating buying is actually 10g lighter it's a 30g and there is also a 36g option as well. I think I will take your advise and stick with the 40g for now and have some fun with my new rod.  We have narrowed the line options down to between 30 and 36g, but as I'm a shite spey caster, the 40 is easier!
Cheers again
Dave

 




Barrio Fly Lines - designed in Scotland - Cast with confidence all over the world

Barrio Fly Lines

Designed in Scotland

Manufactured in the UK

Cast with confidence all over the world

www.flylineshop.com