Fishing The Fly Scotland
Index => Tackle Talk => Topic started by: Terry Coging on 14/07/2018 at 09:12
-
The continuing heat wave has turned my attention back to coarse fishing. Some ancient tackle needed to be replaced so yesterday I bought a new float rod. One rod I tried was a 15 footer, a top of the range Drennan 3 piece. I was astonished at the lightness and power of the slim blank and mused about it being used to make a trout boat rod. 15' would work the top dropper wonderfully. This rod handles carp, but tippets can be as low as 2 1/2lb. Has anyone used a long, light single hander?
-
Terry,
The longest one I have used and owned was 11'6" and it worked the top dropper beautifully and I want another one for wet fly work.
Simba Rods (simbarods.com) do custom long rods including a 12' nymph rod in #4, and 11' #3 and #4 which might be nice as a boat rod. The only place I never liked the long rods was bank work and would only recommend them for boat work.
An 11'3" #5 4 piece with a #5 DT Mallard and a heavyish reel to keep the balance towards the rear would be heaven in a boat. :cool:
Euan
-
Euan, I agree that long rods have no place on the bank. Over the years I have had three 11' rods, each lighter than the previously discarded one, but none have been pleasant to use all day; One reason being that I end up trying to 'cast' with them. My reasoning is that with a light 15' footer I would not need to 'cast' but would instead 'stroke' the water. No false cast, just a sweeping Spey with a 3 or 4 yard shoot. Be a cross between dapping and trad wet fly. Would love to try the theory. It must have been tried before?
-
Euan, I agree that long rods have no place on the bank. Over the years I have had three 11' rods, each lighter than the previously discarded one, but none have been pleasant to use all day; One reason being that I end up trying to 'cast' with them. My reasoning is that with a light 15' footer I would not need to 'cast' but would instead 'stroke' the water. No false cast, just a sweeping Spey with a 3 or 4 yard shoot. Be a cross between dapping and trad wet fly. Would love to try the theory. It must have been tried before?
the loch Maree Hotel Dapping rods were all 15ft, so just Dap Terry then you wouldn't have to cast at all, :z13 Derek Roxborough
-
Derek, why not do both? It sounds the way to offer rising nymphs, emergers and dries all at the same time.
-
Euan, I agree that long rods have no place on the bank. Over the years I have had three 11' rods, each lighter than the previously discarded one, but none have been pleasant to use all day; One reason being that I end up trying to 'cast' with them. My reasoning is that with a light 15' footer I would not need to 'cast' but would instead 'stroke' the water. No false cast, just a sweeping Spey with a 3 or 4 yard shoot. Be a cross between dapping and trad wet fly. Would love to try the theory. It must have been tried before?
Aahhh, now I see what you are trying to do Terry and I love the idea. Three flies on a 15' rod for short lining wet flies sounds ace.
May I suggest talking to Sandy or Rob about getting a carp (or similar) rod re-handled with a fly reel seat and appropriate rings so that you can try out the theory. Shouldn't be too expensive to find out :z4
My only concert would be the leverage that the rod would have when landing a trout. It would have to be quite soft which might lead to other issues.
I reckon there is only one way to find out Terry. :z4 If you build it he will come, as Shoeless Joe once said :cool:
Euan
-
it used to be a bit fraught trying to net fish from a 15ft rod we were doing the netting for people with little or no experience of controlling trout with the long rod, Naa, I'll stick to my 9fter,I can dibble the top dropper quite well enough to catch fish, and netting fish is quite easy, but what ever you want to do it's your fishing after all , good luck, Derek Roxborough
-
it used to be a bit fraught trying to net fish from a 15ft rod we were doing the netting for people with little or no experience of controlling trout with the long rod, Naa, I'll stick to my 9fter,I can dibble the top dropper quite well enough to catch fish, and netting fish is quite easy, but what ever you want to do it's your fishing after all , good luck, Derek Roxborough
Derek,
I love my nine footer for most of my trout fishing but still want longer rod for the boat work. Then I can use the nine footer for dry work and an eleven footer for wet work :z4
I think round about eleven feet is just about perfect for a boat but I can see where Terry wants to go with this.
Euan
-
Who remembers the 'Loch Style' rod that Sandy and I made a few years back?
Anybody still got one?
-
Dapping rods are usually telescopic and use very cheap blanks; not good when playing fish. These modern, high end coarse rods are a different thing entirely. They can control carp and barbel and are amazingly light. The Drennan 15 footer is 5 1/4 oz! They are not designed for casting a fly line, however they should be able to 'waft' up to 15 yards out, which is all I need. Having held one of these I felt that one could fish all day with it quite comfortably. I have bought a 13 footer for general coarse float fishing. Pity the rings are so fine, otherwise would try it with a fly line.
-
Who remembers the 'Loch Style' rod that Sandy and I made a few years back?
Anybody still got one?
Did I ever cast one of those Mike :? That would be back in Haddo days I think ???
Has anyone used a long, light single hander?
Currently I have an Orvis Helios 3 10'6" #3wt out for 'trials'. Technically, this is a nymphing rod.... but having played with it let me assure you that it's much more and I have high hopes. Mind you, it's only 10'6" :wink
I've owned and used a number of 11' and 11'3" rods but the best (and in some ways worst) that I used to own was a Marcus Warwick 12' #6wt C C McLaren 'Sea Trout Special'.
Now that was a superb loch style rod and Marcus and I talked about developing a 12'6" #6wt version with different fittings and a few tweaks as it was way too tip heavy. Sadly the project never got off the ground. But the 12' rod.... well if I still had it then it was a rod that was made for and just waiting for an SLX... but some 25 years too soon. It was just superb at controlling a team of 'bumbles' but due to the tip heaviness was a bit awkward to fish with for longer periods.
When it comes to find light and long for dapping.... Terry I'll be bunging you a PM shortly :z16
H
-
Did I ever cast one of those Mike :? That would be back in Haddo days I think ???
I fished mine when we did that trip up Glen Affric a few years back Hamish ..... I seem to remember that you got quite excited about it :cool: ....... the midgies were fun too :z4
We only made a couple of the 'Barrio Lochstyle' rods and I think we sold a few more blanks for self builds. It was a 10.5 ft #5 rod.
Cheers
Mike
-
If I could get hold of a Drennan Acolyte 15' blank I would get it built into a fly rod just to satisfy my curiosity. It must have been done before? Maybe the blanks have not been available and 15' makes people think 'salmon'? Fly rod blanks are made to cast with, hence they tend to be a bit heavy at 15'. So, who is going to build me a 15' ultralight dibbler special?
.
-
In my opinion the Graphite III GFL & later RPL are the finest Lochstyle rods ever produced, I’ve used the GFL 11’3 & 10’6 Rpl 6 wts for nearly 20 years and still haven’t found a nicer pair of rods for this style of fishing.
-
Gethin. Sounds like you have splendid rods there and have put them to good use. Could you see any advantage with being able to work the top dropper for a couple of yards more? 11' rods are used instead of 9' rods for a reason - why not extend the same reasoning? Maybe time to consider a new breed of rods now that blank material and design permits. I would think of them as 'wafters'. :wink
-
not a new IdeaTerry ,the late AH wood used a 12 ft rod for all his fishing and this was a cane rod, som of my best fishing in a boat was done with an 8ft 4wt while my shoulder healed after using a heavy 10ft-6in rod for a number of years ,it's a bit like archery, 2 new starters came to my group asking about bows I told them to get a light manageable bow but these too were two macho and bought heavy draw weight bows one of them now has a Damaged back and cant draw a bow, the other did something similar, these were men in middle age, I will stick to what I know I can manage, and continue to enjoy my fishing, so don't over bow it will only hurt in the long run, :z18 Derek Roxborough
-
If I could get hold of a Drennan Acolyte 15' blank I would get it built into a fly rod just to satisfy my curiosity. It must have been done before? Maybe the blanks have not been available and 15' makes people think 'salmon'? Fly rod blanks are made to cast with, hence they tend to be a bit heavy at 15'. So, who is going to build me a 15' ultralight dibbler special?
.
I can do you a 15 foot Harrison GTi if interested ;)
-
So, when I first moved to Scotland all those years ago I came with a van load of coarse gear, including a couple of Poles.
At 11m I could "dap" flies right on top of trout from the bank :) I did very well on Loch Saugh off the dam wall. I als used it at a shorter length of plopping worms into pocket water on a local burn.
But wait, there is a better option. Have a look at Bolognese Rods. These are designed for fishing the deep rivers of Europe and are anything from 15-20 feet+, telescopic, but built on high end blanks. Shimano and Daiwa both have a range in the UK. They would easily handle the methods you describe.
Shimano even have a Trout model already at 15 feet... http://fish.shimano-eu.com/content/fish/eu/eu/en/homepage/Product-detail.P-AERNOS_TROUT_GT.html
-
Thanks Rob. The problem with Bolo rods is that the rings are too small for a fly line. I already have a 17 footer. Even the best from Shimano are considerably heavier than the three piece 15' Drennan or even the Shakey Agility 2. I am looking for something light that will work a team of 3 better than an 11 footer. I envisage a long top dropper dancing a daddy for a few yards.
What is a Harrison GTi and how heavy would a 15 footer be?
-
not a new IdeaTerry ,the late AH wood used a 12 ft rod for all his fishing and this was a cane rod, som of my best fishing in a boat was done with an 8ft 4wt while my shoulder healed after using a heavy 10ft-6in rod for a number of years ,it's a bit like archery, 2 new starters came to my group asking about bows I told them to get a light manageable bow but these too were two macho and bought heavy draw weight bows one of them now has a Damaged back and cant draw a bow, the other did something similar, these were men in middle age, I will stick to what I know I can manage, and continue to enjoy my fishing, so don't over bow it will only hurt in the long run, :z18 Derek Roxborough
Derek - my intention is to avoid casting and to fish in a crossover manner with a light rod - something between dapping and traditional team of three Loch style. 15' seems about right for that.
-
Thanks Rob. The problem with Bolo rods is that the rings are too small for a fly line. I already have a 17 footer. Even the best from Shimano are considerably heavier than the three piece 15' Drennan or even the Shakey Agility 2. I am looking for something light that will work a team of 3 better than an 11 footer. I envisage a long top dropper dancing a daddy for a few yards.
What is a Harrison GTi and how heavy would a 15 footer be?
Ah, sorry, I thought you were after a dapping style rod for use with floss/mono. Have you considered a Euro nymph fly line? Whilst not tapered, you can still cast them 10 yards or so.
The GIi is a lovely blank, super action and capable of handling decent fish if one is hooked by mistake. Has a bit of a cult following for river specialists. There are no fancy weaves or wraps, its a good old, super reliable carbon blank.
It is not the worlds lightest blank compared to the top end £500+ match rods, but it is still lighter than a 15 foot salmon rod. It has a lot more low down power that a one of these modern light match rods, more than capable of stopping a big barbell in a heavy flow. They also so it in 17 foot and 20 foot but I think they are special orders now and subject to a surcharge.
Blank at 15 foot is around £150 (ish) and comes in matt or gloss carbon, or a lovely gloss chestnut brown.
Some images of the 14foot SU version. https://www.lureofthefloat.co.uk/blog/14-foot-harrison-su-float-rod-build/
-
Thanks again Rob. I'm thinking about a 14' GTi ringed with fly Fuji's and with a 12" extension. If the fly experiment fails it will be used for barbel - probably still use it for barbel if the experiment works :cool: Can you pm me a price please?
The Euro nymph line sounds interesting.
I am really lucky to be in a club that have a 20 acre trout lake with boats, a 20 acre coarse lake (be there tomorrow) and over a mile of barbel river all on the same site. The perfect place to flux game and coarse ideas.
-
Tried a 15' Bolo tele rod with a DT #2 line. The fishing on our res is dour - like most waters at the moment, so it was a good time to play. I messed around with different leaders and flies and proved that 'wafting and lifting' can work a team nicely, with the top dropper dancing for a fair few yards. I will persevere with this method for a while. Still on a steep learning curve. The Bolo telescopic rod was quite heavy and dead and not pleasant to fish with . I have aquire'd a much lighter 15'/17' coarse rod and it will be tried out this week. The weight 2 line runs through the rings nice and smoothly and it 'wafts' a straight and delicate line on my lawn. Just need to rise a few fish to see what playing a troot is like with a 17' rod :wink
I'm also going to try a w/f #5 line fitted belly first on the reel and experiment with different lengths of running line out of the top ring. This may help the 'waft' and lengthen the dibble. We shall see.
-
The 'long single handed rod' topic has turned out to be 'Very long d/h trout rods' . I've been using a 17' coarse rod with a d/t #2 floater to 'waft' a team of three out. I've toyed with various combinations of leader lengths and flies, along with variations of waft and retrieve/dibble/dap.
Fishing buddies and reservoir staff are having a giggle at my antics, but a couple of boat partners are now watching seriously. The giggles and p..s takings are turning into interest :wink
What does long rod 'wafting' do?
Typically, fishing a team of three from a boat an average angler will be able to -
Achieve a beautiful turnover and feather like presentation with a #2 wt., that an expert would be very pleased with.
Start working the flies better further from the boat with more control with varying winds and drift speed.
Also, for the less able or elderly angler 'wafting' with both hands can put a nice line out with little effort.
More trials needed. I learn a lot every trip.
Oh! playing and landing average sized rainbows on a 17' match rod is OK and I think that finer leaders can be used :z16
-
Duncan Pepper of http://fishinguide.co.uk/ had a 12' #4/5 rated single hander when Euan and I saw him last week, think he said it had come from Poland :z8
I didn't cast it, but looked quite sweet in Duncans hands.
H
-
Hamish. That rod is likely to be an EGO 3.45m #4 Polish nymph rod. Looks nice but not what I'm after.
On the reservoir today testing my mk3 Wafter creation, now at 17' 4" and counterbalanced.