Fishing The Fly Scotland
Index => Main Discussion Area => Topic started by: Gordon Dempsey on 09/06/2016 at 22:58
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Tonight I was fishing the Kinaldie beat on the Don and spotted a fish in the shallows which had very obvious damage to the head. It didn't take a lot of effort to net it and I found that the skin and most of the flesh were gone from the head. The rest of the fish was fine, otherwise it was a beautiful 3/4 pound brownie in great condition, a crying shame. Needless to say I put it out of it's misery.
A couple of days ago within a mile of the same spot I saw a dead fish, maybe 2 pounds, but could only see the underside and couldn't get near it to examine it.
Is there any sort of disease reported on the Don, and has anybody else seen dead or damaged fish on the river? I have a photo but respect admins request not to post photos of dead fish.
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Hi Gordon,
I haven't heard about any problems.
Best wishes
Mike
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I have a photo but respect admins request not to post photos of dead fish.
Have you reported your finding to the River Don Trust ??? http://www.riverdon.org.uk/
Additionally, there's a significant difference between photos of dead fish that have been 'put of their misery' and those that have been chapped on the head needlessly.
By the sound of it, your 3/4lb trout falls into the category where for angling interest a photo would be useful.
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I have also seen over the last week or two a couple of dead trout in the river up where I fish, and a fish of about 2 or 3lb swimming about a pool with what looks like some sort of fungus on his head ( head is all white) and what looks like sores on the body. I have tried to get a hold of him but every time you get the net near him he will take off but you can walk right up to the rivers edge and he won't move just sits there.
Simon
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Sounds like Sapmaligna (sp?) similiar to what rainbows get if badly handled, or (hopefully not as has potential to effect a lot more fish) UDN outbreak, thankfully pretty rare.
I'd certainly be reporting these fish with pics if you can get them
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Pleased to see you're passing the information on and it will be interesting to see what suggestions come forward from the Trust/Board.
Looking at the photo I wondered initially if it were UDN - more common on migratory salmonids, but Brownies do get it - or some other ulcer or damage which is usually compounded in freshwater by a secondary infection such as a Saprolegnia fungus. Now if it were Saprolegnia then this normally gives a white afro or cotton wool type effect to the fishes skin which doesn't appear to be evident in the photo, so I wonder if it is a parasitic infestation :? Probably best wait and see.
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This is getting worrying, I caught one last night in Association waters... I will forward pics onto the River Don Trust.
(http://i651.photobucket.com/albums/uu233/klinkhammer/closeup_2.jpg) (http://s651.photobucket.com/user/klinkhammer/media/closeup_2.jpg.html)
(http://i651.photobucket.com/albums/uu233/klinkhammer/closeup_1.jpg) (http://s651.photobucket.com/user/klinkhammer/media/closeup_1.jpg.html)
Scott
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Yes, doesn't look like Saprolegnia fungus to me either Hamish, from the photo I would pitch a guess at some type of parasitic infestation too.
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That's is worrying Scott, we need to let the River Don team know about this.
I have sent Jim Kerr and Martin an email with a link to this thread.
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Since this seems to be in the head area, can I suggest that if anybody hooks a fish like this, that they remove and dispose of their fly as a simple precaution against any cross contamination with another trout ....... especially since many of us also fish on other local rivers like the Deveron.
We also need to think about cross infection via nets :z17
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There was definitely no Saprolegnia present that I could see, I am familiar with it. This suggests to me that the damage would likely to have been very recent as it doesn't generally take Saprolegnia very long to take hold in an open wound such as the lesions found in UDN or any parasitic infection, and as you rightly pointed out Hamish the wound appears to be very clean.
Scott's photos just came in as I was typing this and what we see there looks like like the early stages of the same thing.
I have written to the Don bailiffs at The River Don Trust with a copy of my photo, let's see what they come back with.
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We also need to think about cross infection via nets :z17
yet another reason to addopt ruber net bags. personally, i think they should be mandatory.
don't know the specifics of the diseases themselves but a similar outbreak causing a lot of fish mortality is currently happening in the French Alps regions. among other reasons studies have proven that the standard woven mesh is indeed a major cause of cross infection.
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To all
Thank you for all the information you have passed on regarding diseased Brown trout seen on the river. If any angler comes across any diseased trout please phone 01330 830080 and give as much information as possible to the fishery office who will answer the call. and further instruction will then be given.
Regards
Jim Kerr
Senior Fishery Officer
Don DSFB
The Don District Salmon Fishery Board
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The water is very low and water temperature has increased dramatically over last few weeks, maybe this has contributed to the recent condition of some trout??
Been looking through some fish pics. This one was caught June last year in low water :z8
(http://i651.photobucket.com/albums/uu233/klinkhammer/june%202015.jpg) (http://s651.photobucket.com/user/klinkhammer/media/june%202015.jpg.html)
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Jim,
My fish was buried on the river bank, but I have a feeling we haven't seen the last of these, let us know if you think it would help to have specimens for examination/autopsy purposes and if so how to get them to you.
Gordon.
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The water is very low and water temperature has increased dramatically over last few weeks, maybe this has contributed to the recent condition of some trout??
Absolutely, yes.
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not sure if anyone has noticed but there is a road being built pretty close by, not saying it's the cause obviously.
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I have a good friend who is very up on his fish diseases etc..
I forwarded the photos & spoke to him on the phone to see what he thought..
It looks either bacterial or viral,
He sees colminarus (sp) in fish quite a bit, it's naturally occurring in most body's of water & signs start around the fishes mouth, as in Scott's photo..
A bacterial infection is the best we can hope for as it's harder to spread & easier for the fish to fight, were as a viral infection will spread like wild fire & is ver hard for a fish to fight off..
These things are usually triggered by either
Unusual water temps
Large water temp fluctuations
Issues with water chemistry
Or worst of all some idiot introducing fish into the river from a unknown source ..
He's offered to send up swab kits so he can get cultures grown off them to see if & what bacteria it is. These need to be done sterile ie no hand , ground contact etc.. But I'm sure the fishery board will be onto this as quick..
The person who he thinks is the at the top of such issues is out the country till Wednesday, but has forward photos to them to see what they think, il let you know the reply in due course..👍
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Great work Alimac. As well as swabs would it be beneficial to have tissue samples too? I guess any fish caught in this condition should be put out of their misery so any amount of tissue could be collected from the affected parts.
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Jim said that if an angler does get a very fresh one, could they bag it and freeze it please, so he can then get it collected.
It can then be taken to Marine Scotland to be examined.
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We discussed skin scrapes too look at under the microscope, but it's unlikley to be a parasitic problem & if it was, the said parasites would die during transit..
Viruses could be checked, but this needs blood taken from a live fish..
He also echoed earlier talk of being very careful with flys nets, hands etc that come into contact with fish, even if no visual signs are seen..
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Jim Kerr will probably get Jamie Urquhart, the Dee/Don Board biologist, to chase all these things up.
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Jees, this is a worry and sad to see infected fish like that . With salmon numbers on the Don having a hard time these days, this is all we need with our Browns. Perhaps not panic stations yet, but I sincerely hope i dont come across any fish displaying any of these signs. Geographical spread of the infected fish on the Don needs understood. I will pass on details of this thread, and cross contamination measures to any angler i meet out there.
KG
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Jim said that if an angler does get a very fresh one, could they bag it and freeze it please, so he can then get it collected
It can then be taken to Marine Scotland to be examined.
Jim..
Has marine scotland said they can do much with a frozen fish? Just because as far as I'm aware once a fish is frozen it kills all the things you'd be looking to test, or bacteria, fungus etc so basically renders it useless for testing..
Id think this will require some good fishermen, a biologist & a day on the river to get any sort of definite results..
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Sounds as though it could be Saprolegnia, a fungal disease, usually on salmon,could be caused by Costia feeding on the slime and destroying the protective coating, we used to see it in a hatchery I worked at,one treatment, if I remember right was Malachite Green to kill the fungus and the costia , it's now banned,
easgach1
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Saprolegnia is an opportunistic fungus that will grow on absolutely anything in water, the furry stuff that grows on uneaten fish food in tanks for example is Saprolegnia. It only attacks fish where there is something exposed and unprotected such as, like you said, slime removal in the case of a Costia infestation or where there has been a physical injury, and cannot attack a healthy fish. The presence of Saprolegnia is therefore a symptom of an ailment but not an ailment in itself. I believe methylene blue may still be a component of current preparations to get rid of it although I do remember malachite green in the dim and distant past and how it stained the silicone in tanks forever!
I am fairly certain that my fish didn't have any Saprolegnia growing on the affected parts which suggests to me that whatever happened happened quickly because a Saprolegnia secondary infection is virtually inevitable when bare flesh is exposed.
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This article about UDN makes very interesting reading. Perhaps it is significant that all the affected fish reported so far have been large - the article states that juvenile fish are generally not affected by UDN and also explains the part played by Saprolegnia. There is also a photo in the article that looks a bit familiar.
http://flyfishing.co.uk/news/news/6396-deadly-wild-salmon-disease-found-in-river-spey-fish.html
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Guys
Wish I'd noticed this post earlier.
Had a couple of Trout last night off Ardmurdo and both had a very small patch of fungus on their snouts.They weighed around 2lb and 1lb respectively.Didn't think much of it and returned them.
Last week a couple of Anglers at Ardmurdo had to give up their evening fishing as there was so much raw sewage floating down the water.Presumably from Inverurie sewage plant.
Could this be a factor?
Duncan
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To all
I have had consultation with Aberdeen Fish health inspector from Marine Scotland today advising , that if any angler catches a Trout that is on the verge of dyeing or very badly diseased, could they keep the fish alive in their landing net and phone 01330 830080 it can then be collected at the river bank alive if possible.
With Thanks
Jim Kerr
Senior Fishery Officer
Don DSFB
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It is interesting that there does indeed appear to be an issue with an unidentified disease/bacterial infection, yet the river is still open for angling.
With the close proximity of the Dee, Ythan and Deveron, I would have thought the sensible measure wound be to stop angling, get the problem identified, and then, if not serious, carry on as normal, or if infectious, you have already put in preventative measure.
Yes it would pee people off, but we could have a potential time bomb about to wipe out our rivers, yet we are still allowed to fish. If it proves to be a false alarm, then we have lost a few weeks fishing....