Fishing The Fly Scotland
Index => Tackle Talk => Topic started by: nosrac on 28/06/2008 at 08:52
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Hi Folks
Having problems finding a leader material that i like, tried fluro but dry flies keep sinking and when pulling nymphs get snapped or knot comes free :mad.
Use Drennen sub surface at moment and have never tried copolymor and do you really need to de-grease the leader when dry fly fishing?
Can anyone suggest a good allrounder but not for silly money.
Cheers
Carson
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What strength fluro' have you been using and which knots :? All have a bearing on my answer but personally I like the Orvis super strong, Riverge Grand Max and Fulling Mill - when it comes to flurocarbon.
Hardys' copolymer is the nicest I've used.
Froghair has a good reputation but have yet to try it myself.
I always degrease my leader when fishing dries, seldom have any issues with the flies getting pulled under myself :wink
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I have used nothing but Rio co-polymer for leader material for years now. I find it reliable, the knots hold well and if I get broken it's my fault. I always degrease the leader when fishing dries and I don't have any problems with the flies being pulled under. I gave up using flurocarbon because I could not get the smaller diameter sizes to sink. It always stayed stuck in the surface film. Maybe I just had a poor brand but it put me right off using it every since.
cheers
Irvine
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I tried Froghair (the frog wissnae very happy) I hated the stuff , kept snapping at the knots.
:z18
Jim
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I think u should try the airflo 3rd generation flurocarbon . I fish dries with it all the time and i never have problems with it sinking the fly or snaping at the knots :) hope this helps ! :z16
clark
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The Aberdonian streak in me balks at the cost of flurocarbon :z4 I use cheapo Drennan Sub Surface for everything and when using it with dries, degrease it with Fullers earth. Seems to work fine. :z18
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l use Airflo Sightfree 8lb for near enough everything, l bought a reel of 7lb FullingMill Co-Polymer and used it for first time today at Loch Insch, first fish and the dropper came off, immediately went back to Sightfree and no probs rest of day.
The knot l used has been same knot for 36 years, basically an overhand, passed through twice, moistened and pulled tight, should l have maybe used something different for Co-polymer
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Funny that Jim....I love Frog Hair and it has never let me down. A few years ago I had problems with the knot coming out on tightening but only in 5X down. Now use the Pitzen knot which is recommended by Frog Hair(see website) and it has never let me down. It is very supple and has high knot strength. I used to loathe Orvis Super Strong but someone! got me back into it and it is fine down to 5X but still not happy using it below this-I find it 'crinkles' too easily.
On the subject of degreasing the leader I never bother and my friend has experimented with and without degreasing and not noticed and more takes to a degreased leader. What I would say is that you get a cleaner lift off to re-cast, a quicker tightening on a fish taking and when fishing small flies your fly is not so liable to getting pulled under. I actually grease the leader when fishing boisterous water with dries to prevent the leader getting dragged under.I know lots of people who are extremely careful about degreasing but it is a personal thing. Ask yourself this....does the fish know/understand what a leader is? Maybe that is a seperate topic!
Richard
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I use 6lb fulling mill fluorocarbon for my buzzer fishing. 8lb Greys fluorocarbon for lures and i'm experimenting with different tippet for dries so far the fulling mill fluoro is still the best its fast sinking so it doesn't sit on top but doesn't drag the fly down either.
Jay
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Airflo Sightfree for me 8lb for the fisheries and 4lb for the River Don.....never had any problems, I use a four turn water knot for droppers never had a breakage. As far as dry flies go, the 4lb stuff sinks at a good rate and keeps a size 14 F-fly afloat......no gink
However......using the same set up as above I had continual problems with the fulling mill stuff. One benefit of the fulling mill stuff however is that it is quite stiff and wire'y and good for preventing tangles on droppers especially loch style when it's windy......
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I will only use Flurocarbon as a "straight" leader with one fly. As soon as you add any form of knot that allows a sudden pull in a different direction you start to have problems. Its just the nature of FC. It has very little "shock" loading resistence so can be almost "brittle" under stress. The more knots and angles the more risk of it breaking.
Also, the shorter the length between knots, the more likely it is the break, so a dropper of 6 inches is more likely to break than a leader of 6 feet.
I have gone back too Drennen Sub Surface.
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Hi
Thanks for all your input to my Question. Think i will stick with what i have been using for years (Drennen Sub Surface) and will always degrease my leader when fishing dry flies.
Hope to catch up with you all at Haddo soon as me and my mate are dying too try float tubing :z4
Thanks
Carson
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Use Fulling Mill 6 and 8 lbs all the time with no problems. Fishing dry i greese up to a 1 1/2ft from the fly this way i get nothing as far as i can see on the surface.
Had a strange experience with the heavier stuff last season. Usuing the 15ft. and 15lbs F. M. i kept cracking flies off [bad casting?] but when i changed to the 12lbs no problems.
My guest who is far more experienced than me [a proffesional coach] had the same bother.
We were both overhead casting as the water was to high to get near the edge. Any help would be most welcome.
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I will only use Flurocarbon as a "straight" leader with one fly. As soon as you add any form of knot that allows a sudden pull in a different direction you start to have problems. Its just the nature of FC. It has very little "shock" loading resistence so can be almost "brittle" under stress. The more knots and angles the more risk of it breaking.
I use Uncle Jack 8lb Flurocarbon & have done for several years, I fairly regularly land 2 fish at a time :z15 :z15 As Mike at Haddo can testify, & I have very rarely have a snap off. :z16
I use a 3 turn water knot to attach my dropper & have landed fish up to 17 1/2lb on this set up. :z15 :z16
I do degrease my leader with a Fullers Earth based mixture prior to going fishing.
Alex
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I use Uncle Jack 8lb Flurocarbon
Cant find it anywhere on the web..can't even find standard tippet material..could you point me in the right direction please..would be very interested in looking at this stuff. Thanks
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Rob
Last lot I bought was 15 x 100 mtr spools from Fishtec sizes from 1 x 5lb 1 x 6lb, 1 x 7lb & 12 x 8lb. They had a deal on the 8lb, BOGOF.
Alex
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I tried Froghair (the frog wissnae very happy):z18Jim
LOL, ye had better not try the Frogs Fanny then :z4
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Rob
If you are out at Haddo I have left a spool of Uncle Jacks for you with Mike today.
Alex
PS Managed to beat my PB today with an 18lber & guess what, it was on the dropper.
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Im using Fulling mill copoly 6lb and 7lb but my droppers (about 6in) keep twisting around the leader what would be the reason for this and how can i stop it?
Dave
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Hi Dave
It can be hard to stop droppers twisting and this is often caused by the fly itself twisting in the current or on the retrieve. Possibly caused by an offset wing on the fly?
Best wishes
Mike
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Or it could be that you have the same casting fault as myself. Unless I am concentrating on it, I move the tip of the rod in a narrow ellipse instead of back and forwards in a straight line. This winds up your fly line like a clock spring and as it untwists it wraps the droppers around the leader. Get somebody to watch your casting stroke to see if you have my bad habit.
cheers
Irvine
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Or it could be that you have the same casting fault as myself. Unless I am concentrating on it, I move the tip of the rod in a narrow ellipse instead of back and forwards in a straight line. This winds up your fly line like a clock spring and as it untwists it wraps the droppers around the leader. Get somebody to watch your casting stroke to see if you have my bad habit.
I me to Irvine , I have the same problem , mind you it does not seem to bother the fish unduly :wink
Cheers
Jim
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Hi Dave
It can be hard to stop droppers twisting and this is often caused by the fly itself twisting in the current or on the retrieve. Possibly caused by an offset wing on the fly?
Best wishes
Mike
Thats just what i was thinking it could be the fly spinning instead of just pulling straight, it happens with flies with no wings also so perhaps it could be a bit of what Irvin was saying about casting technique.
Dave
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bulky flies like sedges & daddies will twist the line
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So far it seems to be stragle fritz cruncher that worst :cry
Dave