Fishing The Fly Scotland Forum

puddock

Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« on: 24/03/2008 at 10:12 »
Does anyone have more info on the possible "re-juvenation" of the Culter Burn? I read a bit recently that plans were afoot to study the feasability of this, due to the fact it is one of the largest tributaries on the Dee.
At present, the burn is in a very poor state. I remember when it used to give fantastic fishing as a youngster, with Brown Trout, Finnock, Perch, Pike & "Flatties" amongst the species caught. I actually got into fishing with Dod Boyne there when I was about 11 or 12......many moons ago.
I seem to remember the Mill Dam was up for sale for ONE POUND! It has filled with silt/ gravel these days.
What a waste of some very good bits water.

Malcolm Copland

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #1 on: 24/03/2008 at 10:51 »
A friend of mine now dead unfortunately, owned the field adjoining it. We used to have some great fun in the summer with the Pike & Perch. I also remember that a Dutch chap use to have Eeel Traps in it and Loch of Skene. He'll be long dead now as well.

Hamish Young

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #2 on: 24/03/2008 at 11:01 »
Puddock - you may have already seen this: http://www.river-dee.org/projectDetail.asp?id=2 but I believe there's more written information in the Dee Trusts 'brochure' for this year.

The guys at Dinnet are very approachable so an email to Mark Bilsby or maybe one of the Trust directors should yield a fuller answer to your query :z17

Rob Brownfield

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #3 on: 24/03/2008 at 11:46 »
he talk I attended the other week regarding the Dee and its tributries was interesting. The Culter Burn was mentioned as being on the hit list, so to speak.

Also, you missed out a very important fish from your list..Minnows, the dam is teeming with them.

puddock

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #4 on: 24/03/2008 at 12:59 »
"Also, you missed out a very important fish from your list..Minnows, the dam is teeming with them."........ Unfortunately though, the Pike don't appear to there in any quantity these days - if there are any at all.

Rob Brownfield

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #5 on: 24/03/2008 at 13:44 »
The place is getting so silted up that the Pike would struggle to survive. No matter what folk think of Pike they are pretty delicate and cannot tolerate poor conditions.

I would love to see the place cleared out and dredged, but i cant see it happening :(

Hamish Young

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #6 on: 24/03/2008 at 14:11 »
All things are possible  :wink

Rob Brownfield

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #7 on: 24/03/2008 at 14:45 »
All things are possible  :wink

Really?...Does that mean I will find diesel on the way home that only costs 23p a gallon? ;)

Hamish Young

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #8 on: 24/03/2008 at 14:49 »
..... sorry - meant to add "if you have an active imagination" :z4

Dream on Rob - even I'd give up on that being possible and I drive a diesel as well  :z6

Rob Brownfield

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #9 on: 24/03/2008 at 15:50 »
In that case, back to Pura veg oil from Tesco at 57p a liter  :z4 :z4 :z4 :z16

Dave Gordon

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #10 on: 24/03/2008 at 18:53 »
The culter burn system provides 157k of habitiat (from memory), once all 3-4 dams are removed/made passable to fish. Most of this is excellent, some in very poor condition, and will need to be improved. The whole system has been surveyed by the Dee Trust, and the Dam has been surveyed and a fish pass has been designed. I believe it is the same design as the one we are fitting to the dam at crathes.
Salmon attempt to leap both this and the Crathes dam every year and the burns have been electro fished above and both have no migratory species parr above the obstruction, no surprise in the case of the culter dam!
The work is to happen this year if everything goes to plan and we will continue to survey the river above the passes to see that it has been a sucess.
This is one of a large number of projects on the Dee system carried out by the Trust at the moment, and these will certainly allow more fish to survive to smolt, and hopefully to return as adults. Habitat improvements have also seen a large increase in the number of Kingfishers being seen, always a good thing!

D

puddock

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #11 on: 25/03/2008 at 08:33 »
Thanks Diver Dave. That is excellent news.

Rob Brownfield

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #12 on: 25/03/2008 at 08:41 »
Dave,
Why are the trust putting a fish pass onto Crathes? If migratory fish got into the loch, they then have no where to go as the far end is shallow marsh. I think I am right in saying there are no burns suitable for spawning. The one that runs through the marsh is shallow, muddy and very very narrow. I believe the marsh is an SSSI and an important habitat for amphibians (newts, so that would be protected anyway) and birds, so the trust could not open this burn up and remove the marsh????? and to tell the truth, if they did I can think of a few people who would be objecting, and rightly so.

Dave Gordon

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #13 on: 25/03/2008 at 10:16 »
Hi Rob

There are a number of reasons for the pass.

On the River Dee, there are several types of obstructions that have partially or completely
obstructed salmonid migration on some of its tributaries. Tributaries are essential to support the
abundant salmon in main-stem rivers as it is the top ends of tributaries that often provide the best
spawning areas for salmon. In Scotland, obstructions which do not allow passage for migrating
salmonids contravene regulations concerning the safe passage of migratory fish (The Salmon
(Fish Passes and Screens) (Scotland) Regulations 1994) and require that either a fish pass be
installed or the obstruction removed. (from the Dee Obstruction report)

Secondly, you are correct, there are some areas of poor habitat, but there are also some areas which are excellent, and much work has already been completed to improve over shading, forestry and fencing issues and silting. I understand that fish do pass the weir, but only in extreme conditions and once there the parr survival is good. When i asked the question of the Dee office they sent me this through, it answers the question far better than i did!
It was prepared by Adrian Hudson, our biologist, another of his excellent papers!

Electric fishing surveys of juvenile fish stocks within the Coy Burn have been carried out for some years now. Habitat surveys have also been carried out on most of the burn. Combining these two survey techniques makes it possible to estimate the potential smolt output that could be gained to the River Dee system if a fish pass was installed in the currently impassable dam.

Electric fishing juvenile surveys in the area of the Coy Burn below the dam have shown average densities of 87.76 salmon parr in a hundred square metres. This extraordinarily high density (10 parr per hundred square metres is considered good) makes the Coy Burn one of the most productive in the Dee catchment.

Unfortunately, not all of the Coy Burn system above the dam has as good instream habitat as that found below. The system above the dam can be divided into three main sections, based on land use and instream habitat types:

Coy Burn to the bottom of the Loch of Park area:   30,200 m2 available. Of this, approximately 500 m2 is good habitat for salmon, and a further 1000 m2 is poor or moderate. The rest is currently unsuitable. Assuming parr densities equivalent to that below the falls on the good habitat, and at 50% on the poor and moderate habitat, this would generate an extra 878 salmon parr.

Loch of Park to Crathes Castle dam:         16,200 m2 available. Of this, approximately 9,000 m2 is good habitat, and a further 3,000 m2 is poor or moderate. Assuming parr densities as above, this would generate an extra 9,216 salmon parr.

Corrichie Burn (a large sub-tributary of the Coy Burn):   7800 m2 available. Of this approximately 6000 m2 is good habitat, but the water quality is not quite as productive as the Coy Burn’s mainstem (the Corrichie Burn runs off the Hill of Fare, heather moorland with extensive coniferous forestry plantations). Electric fishing juvenile surveys would suggest that it could support approximately two-thirds of the parr densities fond below the dam. This would generate an extra 3,510 parr.

Combining these three areas gives a total production of 13,604 salmon parr.

The Coy Burn salmon parr grow very quickly and go out as 2+ smolts. Because of this, only 1+ parr are caught during electric fishing surveys and it is not possible to calculate parr survival figures. If it is assumed that there is 50% mortality over winter, as is true in areas of good habitat that produce 3+ smolts, this parr population would lead to a smolt run of around 6,800.


Before answering i checked with the Dee Project Biologist and Bailif manager and both agreed this one is a good one to improve early on as it will provide a good return for the work carried out, both in terms of seatrout and salmon.
D

As for the amphbians, i did not ask about them but the answer to questions I have asked about similar situations is that man made changes to habitat have favoured some species and damaged others but easing these changes allows the habitat and the species in it to return to a more normal state.

Rob Brownfield

Re: Culter Burn (Leuchar)
« Reply #14 on: 25/03/2008 at 10:55 »
Thanks for the comprehensive reply :)

I must be thinking of the wrong burn as the one I have walked up is more like a soak away for the surrounding land rather than a burn. Will have a walk out that way this weekend for a lookie :)

I have to say i don't agree with the distruction of one habitat for the good of another species, but you could argue that the marsh and bird reserve should not be there as they were artificially created by the daming of the burn.  :z8

Also destroys my plans and discussions with the estate..I wish they had told me about all this before I spent so much time talking to them and preparing papers for them. Guess I will be on the phone this afternoon!  :mad

 




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