hey rob ,thanks for the advice.sorry i did not say thanks sooner but laptop and stomach playing up???fished loch of skene alot before with dead baits but never realised you could flyfish for them there.do you have to wade out far?or do you get use of a boat?fished loch of kinord with flies and was quite successful(6lbs largest).success at alford at the wekend,at last.one at around2lbs and 2 at around 1 lbs.klink and dink for 2 and dry for 1.very happy.thanks again for your time.