Fishing The Fly Scotland Forum

Derek Roxborough

Good News
« on: 03/02/2017 at 18:59 »
It seems the Wild fish reform bill is being shelved , so no criminalisation of Anglers , no Levy, no Rod licence, no Bill, seems Rosanna Cunning ham has seen the light   :z14  easgach 1

Hamish Young

Re: Good News
« Reply #1 on: 03/02/2017 at 19:22 »
Interesting - we'll see if it rises like a phoenix from the ashes in a few years time  :z16

Hamish Young

Re: Good News
« Reply #2 on: 03/02/2017 at 19:39 »

Mike Barrio

Re: Good News
« Reply #3 on: 03/02/2017 at 21:15 »
Interesting news ............. :z16

Mike Thornton

Re: Good News
« Reply #4 on: 03/02/2017 at 21:55 »
 Central Belt invasion on the cards.....   End of angling clubs as we know them......  Who will buy a ticket for "free" fishing.?...  It's politics where "poli" means lots of them, and "tics" mean blood sucking parasites !  This is what Ross Finnie tried to do when he proposed scrapping the Protection Orders about 10 years ago.   Hopefully common sense will prevail.

James Laraway

Re: Good News
« Reply #5 on: 03/02/2017 at 22:28 »
So what does that mean for the Don protection order? The  message on the website looks like you can fish for trout now without permission???

Hamish Young

Re: Good News
« Reply #6 on: 04/02/2017 at 08:15 »
I suspect the status quo will prevail,  if the Bill has been shelved in the interim it strikes me there's little chance of there being any will at Holyrood Towers to do anything other than consider the last 3 years as a 'consultative process'.

It's my hope all the POs in place will continue to be there until something more suitable comes along.

H :cool:

Derek Roxborough

Re: Good News
« Reply #7 on: 04/02/2017 at 13:19 »
I wonder how much it cost the Tax payer? :z8 easgach 1

Rob Brownfield

Re: Good News
« Reply #8 on: 06/02/2017 at 12:57 »
The SG have opened a whole can of worms on this one.

Lots of posts all over the internet saying "Good, free fishing again".  I was speaking to a fellow angler from Stirling yesterday who said folk are fishing Menteith from the bank because they believe they can fish for free!

From the other side of the fence, the Scottish Carp Group, The Scottish Federation of Coarse Anglers and the Pike Anglers Alliance of Scotland, between them representing some 8,000 anglers have said that they are extremely disappointed that the SG have failed to protect coarse fishing in Scotland, or recognise the economic contribution that visiting coarse anglers bring to Scotland.

Derek Roxborough

Re: Good News
« Reply #9 on: 06/02/2017 at 14:14 »
Interesting post Rob, you have to consider that the species you mention aren't native,according to the Chairman of the local salmon fishing board , Pike are an invasive predatory species and should not be returned to the water, not my words but he says it is written in law, so how would that sit with a protection order? locally we have a trout loch with Pike in it , we do not put pike back as we would like to stop feeding the pike with the trout, it's a very emotive subject , we would like just to control the pike, we know we cannot eradicate them , luckily we find some of the larger trout feed on the smaller pike, so there seems to be some sort of balance,  easgach 1

Rob Brownfield

Re: Good News
« Reply #10 on: 06/02/2017 at 16:31 »
Interesting post Rob, you have to consider that the species you mention aren't native,according to the Chairman of the local salmon fishing board , Pike are an invasive predatory species and should not be returned to the water, not my words but he says it is written in law, so how would that sit with a protection order? locally we have a trout loch with Pike in it , we do not put pike back as we would like to stop feeding the pike with the trout, it's a very emotive subject , we would like just to control the pike, we know we cannot eradicate them , luckily we find some of the larger trout feed on the smaller pike, so there seems to be some sort of balance,  easgach 1

What local salmon board are we talking about here?

I must add that no where in Scottish Law is there a law forbidding the return of Pike to the water. There are some by-laws that have been brought in, such as by the Dumfries and Galloway Salmon board that states fish under 5lbs should not be returned, but that is not very different to a nation wide "law" and does not forbide the return of all pike.

I will not go into the non-native argument, there is plenty of evidence to blow that out of the water (excuse the pun).

Hamish Young

Re: Good News
« Reply #11 on: 06/02/2017 at 21:06 »
Necessary to differentiate between most Coarse fish and Pike here I feel.  Pike are as native to many Scottish waters as Brown Trout whereas Bream are as native as.... errr...... Rainbow Trout are  :X2 Sure they've been introduced all over the place - but so have Trout.

There is a 'thing' here which needs to be clear, there is a significantly large indigenous population of Coarse Fish here in Scotland, not all across Scotland it's true but many are native species. Like anywhere we go and 'manage' the habitat to suit whim and fancy some poor bloody fish inevitably becomes some sort of invasive species after a few generation of anglers and scientists. 

If it's a fair representation of the comments made by the Chairman of a DSFB then I'm afraid he must have been the one holding the door when the brains were dished out .....or he has never got past the copious quantities of weed in the 60s, LSD in the 70's and the cocaine he must arguably still be doing. Either that or he has the biggest feckin blinker set known to man and an ignorance unbecoming his position.
But that's just my view.

Derek Roxborough

Re: Good News
« Reply #12 on: 06/02/2017 at 23:00 »
well, there you go,  pike are an introduced species above the highland line, as are many other coarse species
 should we be giving them the same protection as our Native species? it's the Wester Ross DSFB, by the way
it reminds me a bit of the Pheasant, some people wishing to shoot Native Buzzards to Protect Pheasants, but I digress, you must admit it does liven up the forum  somewhat, :X2 easgach 1

Rob Brownfield

Re: Good News
« Reply #13 on: 07/02/2017 at 08:50 »
pike are an introduced species above the highland line,

Records during the 1726 freshwater "fishes" survey mention Pike as far north as Loch Ness, Loch Garry and Loch Arkaig. They are native to the British Isles

Rainbow Trout, first introduced to Scotland in 1885, are a completely alien species to the UK.

Here are some sentences lifted from various scientific papers.:-
  • Introductions to locations outside their native range in the United States , Southern Europe,  Scotland, Australia, New Zealand and South America have damaged native fish species.
    Introduced populations may affect native species by preying on them, out-competing them and transmitting contagious diseases.
    Rainbow trout are predators with a varied diet and will eat nearly anything they can capture.
    They also eat fish eggs.
    Other prey include small fish up to one-third of their length, crayfish, shrimp, and other crustaceans.
    In rivers and streams populated with other salmonid species, rainbow trout eat varied fish eggs, including those of salmon, grayling and brown trout.


And yet they are stocked all over Scotland (Wester Ross in particular) in areas where the native Brown Trout are struggling or have indeed been pushed out by Rainbows. According to the SG, 4.7m Rainbows were introduced to waters in Scotland in 2015.

http://www.gov.scot/Resource/0051/00510483.pdf

Now that's an invasive species!, and I am pleased to say that the SG have recognised this and changed the rules around stocking them.

 :z7

Derek Roxborough

Re: Good News
« Reply #14 on: 07/02/2017 at 12:32 »
Living in Wester ross, I have not heard of Rainbows ousting the Browns at least on our waters, the nearest rainbow fishery is at Tarvie about 45 miles east of here, I know of no others , our club tried rainbows many years back, but they were gone in a couple of seasons, so any other stocking was done with Browns, we have a pike loch stocked there in Victorian times, so  not Native, we have Minnows which were brought in by the Drop minnow "experts" and dumped at the end of the day , Ok we have these fish but should we protect them at the expense of truly Native species?,  it's a can of worms Rob, we will be protecting Mink these seem to be coming Naturalised , should we? I just thought There is a new Rainbow fishery in Assynt using one of the local lochs , easgach 1

 




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