Fishing The Fly Scotland Forum

Iain Goolager

Re: Grayling
« Reply #45 on: 28/10/2009 at 19:45 »
Quote
Am I allowed to have a crack at the Gudgeon and Perch with a float rod and maggot on the Don or is this a big no no??

 :z4 :z4 :z4 :z4 :z4 :z4 :z4

Like it  :z16

Jim Doyle

Re: Grayling
« Reply #46 on: 28/10/2009 at 20:50 »
My first grayling day on the earn this year is the 15th nov. Its a social day that allows folk to have a go with out being under pressure. The cost is £6 this includes breakfast ,lunch and afternoon snacks. Its a good day I thinl ian can confirm this.  If any one wants more details drop me a pm .  jim

Rob Brownfield

Re: Grayling
« Reply #47 on: 29/10/2009 at 16:00 »
Am I allowed to have a crack at the Gudgeon and Perch with a float rod and maggot on the Don or is this a big no no??

Nothing to stop you.."apparently"..but..you are not allowed to float fish, ledger, use maggots, (no worm on some beats), groundbait, loose feed, dead baits (minnows etc), livebaits, banned in Scotland and would have to buy a day ticket, so around £10+  to about £25 depending on where you want to fish.

So, basically, you cannot use accepted methods or bait to catch the fish.


Paul Rankine

Re: Grayling
« Reply #48 on: 29/10/2009 at 20:12 »
Rob and Cerbfan,
       
Quote
So, basically, you cannot use accepted methods or bait to catch the fish.

Depends what fish we are talking about methinks.

It depends whether we want to keep our trout and salmon fisheries as trout and salmon fisheries or let them deteriorate into mixed salmonid/coarse fisheries . 

Plenty coarse fisheries down south.

Why do we need them up here ?


cerbfan

Re: Grayling
« Reply #49 on: 29/10/2009 at 20:49 »
Rob and Cerbfan,
       
Depends what fish we are talking about methinks.

It depends whether we want to keep our trout and salmon fisheries as trout and salmon fisheries or let them deteriorate into mixed salmonid/coarse fisheries . 

Plenty coarse fisheries down south.

Why do we need them up here ?



Maybe, because as much as I love to drive 150 miles plus down to Magiscroft and Orchill to get some decent coarse fishing, I:

a. Don't have the time very often and
b. The inclination as it makes it a full weekend affair and I have to much else going on to occupy my weekends.

No one is suggesting, well certainly not me about stocking coarse fish into your precious rivers, although I am fairly sure no one stocked Gudgeon or Perch into them so I think its fair to call them a native species as is Pike. However I do not see how anyone could object to a purpose built offline dedicated coarse fishery or 3 up here. It would have no affect on the game fishing as long as it was properly managed, not built on a flood plain etc. The only affect it may have is that it might reduce the number of people fly fishing as they take up and enjoy coarse instead. Its not as though there is not a market for it, you only have to look at the popularity or Magiscroft and Orchill to see that who must sell close on 300 to 400 day tickets a weekend between them during the summer months. It is also far better for attracting young people into the sport of fishing as it is generally a lot cheaper and more accessible than game fishing is and at the end of the day I would love more people to be able to enjoy the sport no matter what form it takes.

Iain Goolager

Re: Grayling
« Reply #50 on: 29/10/2009 at 21:08 »
Quote
stocking coarse fish into your precious rivers

How to alienate people in one easy step


cerbfan

Re: Grayling
« Reply #51 on: 29/10/2009 at 21:12 »
How to alienate people in one easy step



Well the 'plenty of coarse fisheries down South' comment was not entirely friendly and welcoming either. I admit though slightly childish and I apologise.

Iain Goolager

Re: Grayling
« Reply #52 on: 29/10/2009 at 21:14 »
graciously accepted
 :wink
Iain

Peter McCallum

Re: Grayling
« Reply #53 on: 29/10/2009 at 21:57 »
Hey guys wasn't there an ice age a few thousand years ag, l;and bridges & all that?? so after the ice age where did the fish come from?? So really all fish in our rivers are non native..... it's simply a matter of time span. Live and let live eh??

I fish for trout because I enjoy that area of the sport. Salmon could be considered as a nuisance as far as I'm concerned and so should be exterminated. Trout similarly, as are coarse fish depending on your taste. We don't piss, moan and throw our toys out the pram about rainbows do we? The whole reason this forum exists is because Mike makes a business out of an 'Introduced' species.

As I said in an earlier post I am led to beleive that Grayling(remember them in the title) were introduced as a food fish along with carp. So lets stop pissing each other off because we are holier than thou about 'our' fishing. Theres plenty of other forums for that on line.

Kev Danby

Re: Grayling
« Reply #54 on: 29/10/2009 at 22:05 »
As a coarse fisher turned fluff chucker this whole business of fly v bait fishing leaves me baffled we all share the same passion and yes there are unsavoury aspects to both styles of the sport. As much as I would dearly love to get the float tackle out and fish a stick float or waggler (some of black pot just screams a waggler) and yes these methods would be extremely effective for trout.

Accept that this will not happen and enjoy fishing the fly and the freedom that brings you certainly cover more water. Sure I miss coarse fishing but there are options up here rather than orchill or maggiscroft try glen of rothes, Moray flyfisher, Kev visits this site and I'm sure he will welcome new faces

I agree perhaps there is opportunity for a land locked coarse fishery in this area comparing this to the cental belt fisheries is somewhat missguided do we really have a sufficient density of population to make this viable :z8

Adapt to what the area gives and just go out and enjoy your fishing.

This thread was about grayling and the options available I really need to get my butt into gear and take up the offer of Mr Doyles invite and yes I'll take both the float and fly gear.



Apologies for the rant

Iain Goolager

Re: Grayling
« Reply #55 on: 29/10/2009 at 22:11 »

Hi Kev,

I went on one of Jims outings and it was spentabulous. That's when I caught my first Grayling on the Czech Nymph. Beautiful fish she was.
Guys come from far and wide - some virgins and some experienced but all made us welcome and shared valuable info.

Highly recommended

Iain

Jim Eddie

Re: Grayling
« Reply #56 on: 29/10/2009 at 22:16 »
No guys its not about Ice Ages or native or non native fish or Fly is better than bait , I mostly fly fish, but have no qualms about trotting a maggot for Grayling, or doing a bit of worming or Sea Fishing.
Neither is it a snob thing that Salmon should take precedence etc my stance is that nature has not put Grayling in Scottish rivers north of Forfar , and as much as I'd like to fish for winter Grayling locally I do not think we should be interfering with nature.
Look at the problems man has caused introducing cane toads in Australia , Grey squirrels in the Uk etc etc

 :z18

Jim      

Paul Rankine

Re: Grayling
« Reply #57 on: 29/10/2009 at 22:31 »
Hi again,
             Peter , this is really not a snob thing . It's a conservation thing.

The introduction of coarse fish , usually illegally , up until very recently , has had and will have far reaching effects on our freshwater salmonid fisheries. why else would Govt. depts. be introducing new legislation in order to protect these fisheries and be engaged in research in order to determine the effects of these introductions.

There are many many examples in freshwater (and marine ) environments of the sometimes disastrous effects of the efforts of "well meaning" individuals or indeed through total ignorance or accident.

It's called Fisheries Management .

Peter McCallum

Re: Grayling
« Reply #58 on: 29/10/2009 at 22:51 »
If it's a fisheries management thing paul don't use the type of language you used, use fisheries management speak. Your tone was condescending and quite rude. Not what I would expect from you.

Ben Dixon

Re: Grayling
« Reply #59 on: 30/10/2009 at 01:13 »

Adapt to what the area gives and just go out and enjoy your fishing.


I agree Kev, totally.

From a FM point of view, we know bugger all about the Don or the fish in it, until we do introducing any further species would be a bad idea until we know a bit more about what we have, that includes any form of stocked trout.  The Don is first & foremost a game fishery despite it containing coarse fish here and there, opening it up for coarse angling would not be a good idea IMO, I do not believe that there are sufficient numbers of coarse fish present to be able to target only them effectively and there would be a large number of out of season game fish caught by those targeting minority species.  Not a snobbery thing, there are several rvers in Scotland with a good head of coarse species and some of those rivers have, in recent times, produced records.  Anglers travel to the Dee from across the globe in search of springers and anglers travel some considerable distance to fish for the large brown trout that the Don is famous for, that is what the Don is about for me, trout.  Nothing against Coarse fish or Coarse anglers but the Don is not a Coarse fishery although it does contain very modest numbres of coarse fish, does it not make sense to go to one of Scotlands rivers that hold good numbers of Coarse fish such as the middle reaches of the Annan to go catch them there?

Cheers

Ben

 




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